S08.01: Cold Open: Craft, Criticism, and Summer Vacation
Season Eight! How is it possible you're all still here?! We're so incredibly thrilled to have you all with us for another season. We've got big plans for talking to your favorite people, getting under the hood of your favorite tropes, and filling your TBR pile with your new favorite books. We quickly find ourselves in the deep end, talking about craft, criticism, and romance’s place in 2025. But first, we share what we did on our summer vacations.
Season Eight. Wowzer. Honestly, we love knowing you're out there. Thank you so much for listening.
If you'd like more romance chat in your life, please consider joining our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! There, magnificent firebirds hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
SHOW Notes
If you’re a writer looking to learn more about in person events for romance craft, check out Romancing the Craft in Anaheim this fall or Spring Fling which will be hosted by Chicago North Romance Writers in spring of 2026.
Australia is not actually a land of criminals, but Tasmania is a dark place…the sky we mean. On the This is Love podcast, there was an episode about it! Check out the Night Sky app, which will help you identify the stars you are seeing in the night sky.
Martha’s Vineyard is great, actually. But watch out for ticks and sharks. Speaking of Jaws, it’s a different vibe without that music and here’s more about John Williams and the power of the score.
AP isn’t doing book reviews anymore, and that means that there will be less book news in papers across America. We talked about the decline of cultural criticism this week. Similar declines can be found in music criticism and film criticism. This goes hand in hand with news that less Americans are reading for pleasure.
Across storytelling mediums, people are noticing a breakdown in the ability to tell a story. Here’s a great essay about the difference between premise and narrative in film. Here’s a really interesting thread from Blue Sky wondering if Sci-Fi is a genre that’s dying.
Ten years ago gay marriage passed and it felt like the world had changed, but they’re determined to roll them back. Keep fighting.
Sponsors
Blue Box Press, publishers of Kristen Ashley's Finding the One, available at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
HarperCollins, publishers of Laurie Gilmore's The Gingerbread Bakery, available at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Vasilisa Drake, author of A Bargain So Bloody, available at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, or Apple Books or wherever you get your books. Get the audiobook wherever you listen.
Lumi Gummies, THC gummies available nationwide. Go to Lumigummies.com and use code FATEDMATES for 30% off.
Between Seasons Palate Cleanser: Fated Mates Live St. Louis!
This year's Fated Mates Live was a little different than those we've hosted before, as it was also launch day for Sarah's These Summer Storms! We celebrated in style in the Midwest, hosted by the fabulous team at indie bookstore (and romance lovers), Novel Neighbor and joined by our absolute favorite, Kate Clayborn.
So many Firebirds turned out to celebrate with us from across the midwest to help Sarah learn the intricacies of Midwestern Romance Heroes™️, to talk about Derek Craven and others, and to celebrate Storms in style. The audience was, unfortunately, without microphones, so some of the event has been edited from this recording, but we hope you'll get the vibes -- and learn a little about the midwest! (We apologize for the Indiana and Connecticut shade within.)
Thanks to everyone who came out to celebrate with us -- we couldn't have asked for a better event, or a better launch day for These Summer Storms. Thank you for reading, for hanging, and for standing in an endless line to meet us and spend a little of your rainy Tuesday with us!
07.49: Season Seven Ends Not With a Bang, but With a Kombucha Girl
We’re wrapping up season seven by asking ourselves a simple question. Do we like this stuff? Yes? No? Maybe so?
We’ll be back in two weeks for the start of Season Eight of the podcast. Honestly, we remain amazed that y’all are with us on this journey. In a world full of madness, you bring us calm, joy and purpose, and we couldn’t be more grateful for you. Thank you so much for listening.
While you’re waiting for Season Eight, you’re welcome to join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Notes
The Komboucha Girl was sick of seeing her face back in 2019, and yet here we are.
Hozier in concert was great, even if his parents were not stars on the NBC soap, Days of Our Lives. That was John and Marlena. The visuals on Eat Your Young and Nina Cried Power were especially moving and inspiring. Someone made a playlist of the Nina Cried power songs, and now is a great time to listen to protest music.
The impact 50 Shades had on the sales of ties (and other things) was real.
An article from MEL about the wet problem, not just in romance, I guess. (that’s a NSFW link based on the headline and content, okay.) Butts tie these two clips together: Miranda on SATC on “are we doing this now?” and Tom Hanks in Sleepless in Seattle thinking “some lady is going to want to do it her.” But overall, spit is important.
Fucking her ass, saving her life is a quote from a Shayla Black book and this amazing review from Smart Bitches, Trashy Books. Truly a Romancelandia classic.
EM Forester described flat and round characters in Aspects of the Novel (1927).
“The second shift” was a phrase used by author Arlie Russell Hochschild to describe the housework and childrearing responsibilities faced by women after coming home from their day jobs.
Commuting is really bad for your wallet and bad for your health.
Go to a farmer’s market if you must.
Books
Sponsors
Blue Box Press, publishers of the Hearts and Hidden Secrets: A Family Romance Collection featuring Devney Perry, Helena Hunting, Lauren Blakely and Tijan, available at Amazon.
Rose Prendeville, author of Grace on the Rocks, available at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Avery Flynn, author of Head Witch in Charge, available at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, or Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
S07.48: Con Artists & Criminals With Joanna Shupe
Joanna Shupe joins us this week to celebrate her new book, The Gilded Heiress, and talk about one of our favorite things—baddies with a heart of gold! We talk about the book, about our mutual love of criminals, of noble scoundrels, of con artists and basically anyone willing to do crime in the name of love. We also talk about how everything Gilded Age is back again, which…ugh. We love Joanna and her book – come see us with her in Chicago on August 28th and in Brooklyn on September 9th.
You can get The Gilded Heiress right now in print, ebook or audio at Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Books
Notes
Welcome Joanna Shupe, who writes mafia romance as Mila Finelli. Next week, her historical The Gilded Heiress comes out next week. Earlier this summer, she released her latest in the New York State of Mafia series, Empire of Seduction. You can see her on book tour starting the week of August 26th, including with Jen in Chicago on August 28th.
Pinkertons & Bow Street Runners were early cops and private investigators.
Check out Joanna’s TikTok, which explores how the history of the Gilded Age is very relevant again: Tariffs are pretty bad, actually; the attempt to build an all white town in Arkansas, inspired by Apartheid South Africa, you can learn about Sundown Towns, Redlining, and racist housing covenants.
Al Swearengen is a character on the show Deadwood based on a real person.
The Gilded Heiress pays homage to Anastasia the Disney movie, which is itself a retelling of the story of Anastasia Romanov. The novel also explores the famous crime of the kidnapped Lindbergh Baby.
Sponsors
Amy Andrews, Pippa Roscoe, Rachael Stewart and Clare Connelly, authors of The Karma Club series, available in print or ebook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
Maureen Lee Lenker, author of His Girl Hollywood, available in print, ebook or audiobook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Lumi Gummies, THC gummies available nationwide. Go to Lumigummies.com and use code FATEDMATES for 30% off.
S07.47: Bodyguards
It’s Bodyguard Romance week, which feels impossible, honestly, considering we’ve definitely done this before, haven’t we? According to Eric and also the internet, we haven’t, which means we get to talk for the first time in seven seasons about why Bodyguards work so well for so many romance readers, including us! We talk about the basics – the innate joy of having an Exasperated Man™️ willing to put himself in front of a bullet for you, the absolute delight of the books that turn the whole thing on its head and make the protector the protected, and yes, Whitney Houston. Also, Jen makes a brilliant observation on surveillance culture and how it’s impacting romance. We’re keeping you safe from the baddies this week.
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Notes
In a recent interview Kevin Costner talked about his feelings about Whitney Houston. Dolly Parton and Whitney Houston’s versions of I Will Always Love You, Whitney’s isolated vocals on How Will I Know, and Whitney sang the Star Spangled Banner at the Super Bowl in 1991 and the New Yorker article about it.
Caroline has created a bodyguard collection featuring books across subgenres.
The Big Easy is a movie with Dennis Quaid (he’s crazy now) and Ellen Barkin where he is a cop who uncovers corruption on the force.
Everyone, it looks like this thing about not needing a PI license in the state of Wyoming is legit, go forth and spread the news.
Books Mentioned this Episode
Sponsors:
1001 Dark Nights, publishers of the Duty and Desire: A Uniformed Heroes & Bodyguard anthology featuring Aurora Rose Reynolds, Kristen Ashley, Kylie Scott & Rebecca Zanetti available at Amazon.
Hunter Snow, author of Gone Country, available at Amazon, B&N or wherever you get your books.
Lumi Gummies, THC gummies available nationwide. Go to Lumigummies.com and use code FATEDMATES for 30% off.
07.46: Natural Born Charmer by Susan Elizabeth Phillips
We're back with a deep dive episode on one of our favorite Susan Elizabeth Phillips books, Natural Born Charmer. Jen thinks this one marks SEP's Imperial Period, and Sarah looks askance at the term romcom to describe romance novels. We're back on our bullsh*t, is what we're saying. We're talking plot, character, risk-taking, and how romances can feel wildly expansive.
This is our last deep dive of Season 7 -- more in Season 8, which begins in September. If you want to talk in depth about specific books, though, maybe you'd enjoy being a member of our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Notes
You can get Susan Elizabeth Phillips's Natural Born Charmer at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
In season 2, we did a deep dive of an earlier Chicago Stars book, Nobody’s Baby But Mine. We also did an episode with Susan in season 3. It’s the interview that made us realize we should keep interviewing romance trailblazers. Jen was on Learning the Tropes to talk about another SEP book, Kiss an Angel.
In 2003, the song Hey Ya by Outkast was number 1 for 9 weeks at the end of that year and into early 2004. In 2018, Rolling Stone ranked the song #4 in the top 100 songs of the 21st Century So Far.
This article from Spin describes what it means when an artist is in their imperial period.
Almost Famous (2000) is amazing movie about the rise and fall of a 70s rock band.
A great thing happened during the baby races halftime show last week at a Las Vegas Aces game last week. Also at the Indiana Fever game.
Sponsors
Scarlett Xavier, author of Irish Fire and Forbidden Love, available in print or ebook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
Avon Books, publishers of Mason Deaver's The Build-a-Boyfriend Project, available at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Claire Trella Hill, author of Black and Deep Desires, available at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, or Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Avon Books, publishers of Holly Michelle's Last Night Was Fun, available in print, ebook or audio from Amazon, Apple Books, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, or wherever you get your books.
S07.45: Reading Down Under: Australian Romance Novelists
By request (and because Sarah needed books for her upcoming trip), we're talking about romance novels by Australian authors this week, with a nod to some New Zealanders as well. We discuss how historical romance has much maligned Australia, recommend some absolutely terrific books, many of which we've actually done deep dives on, and we talk about why so many Australian romances hit the spot with American readers.
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Our next read along (next week!) is Susan Elizabeth Phillips's Natural Born Charmer. You can get it at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Books by Australian Romance Authors (AND SOME NEW ZEALANDERS)
Notes
French Kiss is not available on streamers and it's very upsetting for those of us who know the deep magic of Kevin Kline & Meg Ryan.
Australia is not the nation of criminals historical romance novels would like you to believe, but a lot of criminals did get sent there over an 80 year period from 1788-1868.
Sarah is going to talk to the Romance Writers of Australia and the Romance Writers of New Zealand next month. Yes, she'll be going to Port Arthur in Tasmania to check out the place where all those criminals were sent.
Victor Gadino illustrated the stepback for Dream Fever by Katherine Sutcliffe
Mills & Boon is a British romance imprint, in North America these books are published under the name Harlequin.
When Sarah talked about The Australians in the early years of Mills & Boon, she was wrong, and likely thinking of Diana Palmer's 1985 The Australian. The Australians series was a 12 book series in the early 2010s from Harlequin Presents.
The book Raising the Stakes by Jess Dee is no longer available in Kindle, but maybe it is in other countries or maybe you downloaded it in the past? Check out her available titles here.
Listen to the Deep Dive episodes on:
Devil’s Bride and the Cynster family by Stephanie Laurens
The Stage Dive series by Kylie Scott
Caressed by Ice by Nalini Singh
Sponsors
World Gone Wrong: A fictional chat show about friendship at the end of the world, available at audaciousmachinecreative.com and wherever you listen to podcasts.
Sophie Morgan, author of Season of the Witch, available at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Louisa Darling, author of Scoundrel Take Me Away, available at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, or Apple Books.
S07.44: Relentless Competence & Fixers in Romance
It's been several years since the last time we talked about the allure of competency in romance, but it's a topic we adore, so here we are again, talking about characters with relentless competence and the characters who love them beyond measure. If you're new here, welcome! We're happy to have you!
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Our next read along is Susan Elizabeth Phillips's Natural Born Charmer. You can get it at Amazon, B&N, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
the Books
Notes
The These Summer Storms tour is a wrap, ending with Sarah in conversation with Rebecca Baumann from the Lilly Library at the Mallow Run vineyard.
That one movie with Keanu Reeves and a vineyard is called A Walk in the Clouds (1995).
You can’t grow grapes anywhere, but you can grow them in a lot more places than you’d think.
The Nora Roberts book about fossils called Birthright, and here’s the manga Dreaming of You. Look at all these editions of Wuthering Heights.
There’s a recent update on the search for Amelia Earhart’s plane from just a few weeks ago.
Watch the video of Delta’s flight crew uniforms over time.
Jen was interviewed by Lauren Sarner from the New York Post for an article about love triangles in pop culture because of the return of The Summer I Turned Pretty.
Ranger vs Morelli has been going on for far too long, or maybe it’s over?
We last officially talked about careers back in Season 2, episode 8.
Speaking of fixers, you might enjoy the movie Michael Clayton.
Our next deep dive is Natural Born Charmer by Susan Elizabeth Phillips.
Sponsors
Hillary Bowen, author of Out With Lanterns, available in print and ebook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books, and Bookshop.org.
Wattpad Books, publisher of Z.W. Taylor's The Pack, available in print, ebook and audio from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books, and Bookshop.org.
Lumi Gummies, THC gummies available nationwide. Go to Lumigummies.com and use code FATEDMATES for 30% off.
S07.43: Trailblazer Pamela Sanderson
Our Trailblazer series continues with Pamela Sanderson, the first Native American author to write contemporary romance about Native characters in Native community. Pamela joins us to talk about her writing journey, about her decision to write and independently publish romance, about the need for more Native American romance in the world. We so enjoyed this conversation, and we’re grateful to Pamela for joining us to tell her story.
Listen to all the Trailblazer episodes.
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Notes
Pamela Sanderson is an enrolled citizen of the Karuk Tribe, located in northwest California on the Klamath River. Pamela also publishes in other genres as Pamela Rentz.
People Mentioned this Episode: Louise Erdrich, N. Scott Momaday, Johanna Lindsay, Kathleen E. Woodiwiss, Stephen King, Anne Rice, On the Island by Tracey Garvis Graves, Courntey Milan, Sarina Bowen, Love is a War Song by Danica Nava, Ali Hazelwood, Tessa Dare, Alexis Hall, Theory of Bastards by Audrey Schulman, the TV show North of North, The Only Good Indians by Stephen Graham Jones, and Rebecca Roanhorse.
Writing Workshops: Clarion West and Romancing the Craft
The Dear Author blog was an early, vocal fan of Pamela’s work.
If you are interested in KidLit or have children, you should be familiar with Debbie Reese and her blog, American Indians in Children’s Literature.
The Crooked Rock Series
Sponsors
Blue Box Press, publishers of Jennifer Probst's The Reluctant Flirt, available in print and ebook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books, and Bookshop.org.
Kylie Scott, author of Wildflowers: An End of the World romance, available in print and ebook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books, and Bookshop.org.
World Gone Wrong: A fictional chat show about friendship at the end of the world, available at audaciousmachinecreative.com and wherever you listen to podcasts.
Renée Ahdieh, author of Park Avenue, available in print, ebook, and audio at Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books, and Bookshop.org.
S07.42: Jen & Sarah and These Summer Storms
Last night’s Fated Mates Live was so much fun, but now we’re back in your earholes. It’s time again for our annual Sarah MacLean deep dive (with no spoilers!). As per tradition, Jen asks Sarah a bunch of fun questions and forces Sarah to talk about her book. And it all ends with Julia Whalen reading two chapters of These Summer Storms!
It was a delight to see so many of you in St. Louis yesterday, and to everyone else, we’re just as glad you’re here with us today.
Notes
It’s finally time for These Summer Storms! And it might not be too late to see Sarah on book tour! Mary Kay Andrews is very fierce on Instagram, and we love her for it. You can also see her with Renee Adiah, author of the forthcoming Park Avenue, which she mentions at the end of the show.
When the New York Times published their Best Books of the 21st Century so far, Sarah shared her ballot.
Rhode Island has a long history of being associated with big money.
Sarah wrote a good chunk of Storms at the Brownell Library in Little Compton, Rhode Island. Its outdoor space is a great place to read a book.
On Inside the Actors Studio, the host James Lipton always ended with the same list of questions, known as the Pivot questions after their originator Bernard Pivot. Similarly, the New York Times column By the Book (Jen called it Get Booked, sorry for any confusion!) has a rotating list of questions, but some are very common. If you are interested in reading some of these columns, check out By The Book: Writers on Literature and the Literary Life, published in 2015. The books on Sarah’s nightstand were: The Second Coming by Carter Sherman, It’s a Love Story by Annabel Monaghan, Can’t Get Enough by Kennedy Ryan, and Full Bloom by Francesca Serritella.
Fated Mates Live in St. Louis!
Storm Inside
Sponsors
Kylie Scott, author of Wildflowers: An End of the World romance, available in print and ebook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books, and Bookshop.org.
1001 Dark Nights, publisher of Midnight Myths and Magic, available in print and ebook from Amazon.
Mina Brower, author of A God of Moonlight and Stardust, available in print, ebook, and with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
Avon Books, publisher of Scotch on the Rocks, available in print, ebook, and audio from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books, and Bookshop.org.
S07.41: Audiobooks with Julia Whelan
We're excited to have audiobook queen and Voice of the Summer, Julia Whelan with us today! Aside from being the voice of Emily Henry, Taylor Jenkins Reid, VE Schwab and Kristen Hannah, she's also an author of her own delicious books and the founder of Audiobrary, an audio book company that pays narrators on a royalty structure. She's here to talk about her journey to writing and to narrating, about the way she thinks about her work, her advocacy, and the world of audiobooks. We are so incredibly thrilled to have her!
Julia is also the narrator for Sarah's book, These Summer Storms, available next week wherever books are sold. The audiobook is perfection, and you can read it on Audible, LibroFM or Apple Music...or wherever you get your audiobooks.
There are still tickets to see Sarah on tour in NYC, Chicago, Winston-Salem, NC, Newport, RI, Cambridge, MA, Decatur, GA, or Franklin, IN. There are a handful of tickets still available for Fated Mates Live in St. Louis, MO on July 8th! Join us!
If you can't make the tour, you can preorder These Summer Storms signed with a special romance dust jacket from The Ripped Bodice.
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Show Notes
Welcome Julia Whelan, audiobook narrator extraordinaire and the founder of Audiobrary. A Netflix movie of her book My Oxford Year is coming soon.
Sarah wants you to know that she realized later that she was remembering the plot of The Girl on the Train when she was talking about the audiobook Gone Girl, but that they're both bangers.
Like everything, AI is creeping into the audiobook world.
An audiobook Julia recommends is Jess Walters’s Beautiful Ruins, narrated by Edoardo Ballerini.
Books Mentioned This Episode
Sponsors
Avon Books, publishers of Alexandra Paige's An Irish Summer, available in print, ebook or audio from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Chelsea Fagan, author of The High Dive, available in print, ebook or audio from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Apple Books, Kobo or wherever you get your books.
Alyxandra Harvey, author of A Deal with the Devil, available in print, ebook or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
MA Wardell, author of Stirring Spurs, available in print, ebook or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
S07.40: Hot 2025 Summer Reads
We're both staying very still in front of air conditioners this week, so that means we're very happy to have a bunch of books at the ready! We're teeing up your piles of summer reads with our quarterly romance roundup! As a reminder, we haven't read most of these books -- but they're the ones toppling our TBR! Preorders mean a lot more than they should these days, so if there's anything on this list that makes you go "oh, yes. that's for me," and you're able to preorder from your local bookstore (or from Pocket Books Bookshop with the code PREORDER) or reserve at your local library. The authors on this list thank you.
As a reminder, Sarah has a new book out on July 8th -- go see her on tour in NYC, Chicago, Winston-Salem, NC, Newport, RI, Cambridge, MA, Decatur, GA, or Franklin, IN. There are a handful of tickets still available for Fated Mates Live in St. Louis, MO on July 8th! Join us!
If you can't make the tour, you can preorder These Summer Storms signed with a special romance dust jacket from The Ripped Bodice.
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
JUNE RELEASES
july releases
August Releases
September Releases
Sponsors
Pocket Books Bookshop, a feminist, antiracist, queer owned bookshop in Lancaster, PA. Preorder any upcoming book from their website and use the code PREORDER for 15% off! Get These Summer Storms signed by Sarah from them.
Kay K. Denner, author of Again, Scoundrel, available in ebook from Amazon.
Kara Kentley, author of Another Summer, available in print or ebook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Lumi Gummies, THC gummies available nationwide. Go to Lumigummies.com and use code FATEDMATES for 30% off your order.
S07.39: Dysfunctional Families (The FUn Kind)
This week, we're talking about romance's most common family: the dysfunctional one! Sarah wrote a book about one, so we're thinking about what makes them special to romance, and what sets the romantic dysfunctional family apart from the ones that live outside of the genre. Jen has five categories. There's a game involved. You can play along at home!
If you love this one, you can listen to our Daddy Issues (not the fun kind) episode with C. Travis Rice. And if you just want to listen to an episode about Daddies (the fun kind), we've got you.
Sarah's book, These Summer Storms is out in three weeks and she is going on tour! What's more, there is a real deal Fated Mates LIVE planned for July 8th in St. Louis, MO! Get tickets to any of these events (Jen will be at a bunch of them, and other pod friends will be popping up along the way) at sarahmaclean.net/tour! If you can't make the tour, you can preorder These Summer Storms signed with a special romance dust jacket from The Ripped Bodice.
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
dysfunctional family recs
Notes
If you love Derek Craven, check out the newest entry at the Fated Mates Collections Department, Spectacular Spectacles courtesy of Sanj.
You can listen to our Susan Elizabeth Phillips episode as you do your “one a days.” (When we recorded all the eBooks were on sale, but they aren’t anymore. SORRY.)
According to Psychology Today, there are 5 specific types of dysfunctional families.
Jen called it a Drive-Thru in Dream a Little Dream, but she meant a DRIVE-IN. Maybe go to one if you want and report back, idk! Or the new version is this Rooftop Cinema Club, where you sit together with bluetooth headphones.
A great discussion of why it’s problematic or damaging to always redeem the family, read this powerful essay about why queer people have the right to leave their harmful family members behind by Nathan Burgoine.
You, too, are heroically well-adjusted.
Sponsors
Kristen Jennings, author of Lessons From a Tour Guide, available in print, ebook, audiobook or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
Underlined: Where Books Are Life, a place for young readers to explore and find their next book obsession along with quizzes, reading lists, book trailers and more. Visit getunderlined.com.
Amy James, author of Crash Test, available in print, ebook, or audio from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple or wherever you get your books.
S07.38: Second Chance Romance Redux
We're taking a second run at second chance romance this week, and while we intended to recommend a million books, we ended up talking about all the ways this trope really works and really doesn't work for us! We're talking about rekindling love, unrequited love, resurrecting old wounds, the unforgivable stuff and of course, pining. It's a long one, and yes, Jen is talking about present tense.
If you love this one, you can listen to our first Second Chance Romance episode with Priscilla Oliveras here.
It's that time of year again--Sarah's next book, These Summer Storms is out in July and she is going on tour! What's more, there is a real deal Fated Mates LIVE planned for July 8th in St. Louis, MO! Get tickets to any of these events (Jen will be at a bunch of them, and other pod friends will be popping up along the way) at sarahmaclean.net/tour! If you can't make the tour, you can preorder These Summer Storms signed with a special romance dust jacket from The Ripped Bodice.
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
second chance romance recs
Show Notes
Everyone watches women’s sports. You can watch basketball, women’s soccer, and the new softball league. Get out there, go do stuff in your town!
We had a second chance romance episode back in season 3 with Priscilla Oliveras.
Sponsors
1001 Dark Nights, publishers of Dark Clouds and Bright Skies: A Grumpy Sunshine Collection, with novellas by Joanna Wylde, Kristen Proby, Larissa Ione and Laura Kaye, available in ebook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
Ava Miles, author of The Hockey Experiment, available in print, ebook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
Meghan Quinn, author of Till Summer Do Us Part, available in print, ebook, or audiobook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
Avon Books, publishers of Holly Michelle's Last Night Was Fun, available in print, ebook or audio from Amazon, Apple Books, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, or wherever you get your books.
S07.37: Run Posy Run by Cate C. Wells
Another deep dive episode, and this one feels like it shouldn't have taken so long! We're reading Run Posy Run, talking about the way Cate C. Wells walks a fine line of mafia romance while keeping the book on the morality chain side of the line from dark romance. We talk about heroines against the wall, heroes who have to suffer, the way violence fits into these romances, and about sex and how it's deployed in these books to enormous effect.
We love this one (as you all know), and we were so excited to go back to it and give it the deep read it deserved. You can find all of our deep dives at the Fated Mates Book Club.
It's that time of year again--Sarah's next book, These Summer Storms (complete with sexy, silent, deeply competent hero) is out in July and she is going on tour! What's more, there is a real deal Fated Mates LIVE planned for July 8th in St. Louis, MO! Get tickets to any of these events (Jen will be at a bunch of them, and other pod friends will be popping up along the way) at sarahmaclean.net/tour! If you can't make the tour, you can preorder These Summer Storms signed with a special romance dust jacket from The Ripped Bodice.
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Show Notes
A boat, ship whatever, ran into the Brooklyn Bridge, and here’s a video of a woman who is a mariner explaining what might have happened.
The Chicago River is an engineering marvel. In 1887, they reversed the river and sent it out to the Mississippi rather than having it flow into Lake Michigan. They were moving rivers around in Rhode Island because of Mayor SOMEBODY and his desire to turn Providence into the Venice of the United States. Waterfire is a Providence thing, but it isn’t the same as the water fire[s] in Cleveland. The greatest of the Great Lakes is Lake Superior, to be honest, and it’s not afraid to tell everyone about it. Station Eleven is a great book set in and around the Great Lakes. No one ever talks about Lake Huron except for Jenny Holiday. Great Lakes, Great Times!
The New Jersey mob loved The Sopranos.
There is a short story now available about Dario & Posy’s daughter called Made Man.
You can listen to our previous episodes for more about the difference between morality chain and dark romance.
The Sponsors
Patricia Grayhall, author of A Place for Us, available in print and ebook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Underlined: Where Books Are Life, a place for young readers to explore and find their next book obsession along with quizzes, reading lists, book trailers and more. Visit getunderlined.com.
Darci St. John, author of Racing Heart, available in print, ebook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
Avon Books, publishers of Alexis Daria's Along Came Amor, available in print, ebook or audio from Amazon, Apple Books, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, or wherever you get your books.
S07.36: Celebrity + Normie Romance
Sarah is over the moon that we're talking about celebrities again, especially because we're keeping it tight this time around and limiting it to celebrity/normal person romance (mostly -- Jen is ungovernable)! Yes, Sarah is going to talk about Perfect, but also we're going to talk about celebrities who fall for stranger normies, for normies they knew before they were celebrities, for normies who work with them, and for normies who protect them. The episode is 1200 books long and honestly, we're not sorry.
In case you wondered why Sarah is breaking her rule about talking about her own books, it's that time of year again! Her next book, These Summer Storms (complete with sexy, silent, deeply competent hero) is out in July and is going on tour, and there is a real deal Fated Mates LIVE planned for July 8th in St. Louis, MO! Get tickets to any of these events (Jen will be at a bunch of them, and other pod friends will be popping up along the way) at sarahmaclean.net/tour! If you can't make the tour, you can preorder These Summer Storms signed with a special romance dust jacket from The Ripped Bodice.
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Our next read along is Cate C Wells's Run Posy Run, available right now in print or ebook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited at Amazon, Apple Books, and Libro.fm.
Notes
Pilsen is a great Chicago neighborhood that has historically been home to Mexican-Americans, including stunning murals throughout the neighborhood. But also, that Chicago dust bowl of 2025 was not so great!!
Summer book tour is upon us. Check out Sarah’s book tour, including dates for Fated Mates Live. In Chicago, Jen will be at The Last Chapter with Mia Sosa for her book When Javi Dumped Mari on June 30th and the Books in Bloom Event hosted by the Chicago North Romance Writers in July.
Jen went out for Kennedy Ryan’s tour for her new book, Can’t Get Enough.
We’ve had versions of the celebrity romance in previous seasons: the celebrity romance in season 4, way back in season 1 we did an episode on rock star romance, and sports romance with Jenny Nordbak in season 1, with Farrah Rochon in season 3, and Jessica Luther in season 6. And no, we haven't done a bodyguard episode, but check out Caroline's "I Can Be Your Bodyguard" collection!
The primordial celebrity/normie romance for Jen is the movie Notting Hill with Hugh Grant and Julia Roberts. For Sarah, the primordial celebrity normie book was Perfect by Judith McNaught. As it turns out, Hugh Grant and Hugh Jackman are not the same person.
CELEBRITY+NORMIE BOOKS
SPONSORS
Alice Murphy, author of A Showgirl's Rules for Falling in Love, available in print and ebook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple or wherever you get your books.
Blue Box Press, publishers of Lexi Blake's Built to Last, available in print, ebook or audiobook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Apple, Kobo, or wherever you get your books.
Bailey Seaborn, author of All Twerk, No Play, available in print, ebook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
Avery Maxwell, author of Heart Strings and Hotlines, available in print or ebook, from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, or Bookshop.org.
Vedentro, premium leather accessories. Use code FATHER at checkout to get $25 off. If you sign-up on the website you will receive an email with an additional $45 off, for a total savings of $70. Visit vedentro.com for more info.
S07.35: On the Shelf with Spinsters & Wallflowers
One of the OG romance tropes is on the table today -- we're talking about heroines who are on the shelf! It's not quite wallflowers, not quite ruined, not quite spinsters...it's a very particular flavor of unmarried woman, and one we basically only find in historicals (can you tell Sarah is writing?). We're talking about the subtle nuances of heroines on the shelf and honoring some of the classics...but Sarah's got a batch of books we've never talked about before!
Also! It's that time of year again! Sarah has a new book out in July and is going on tour, and there is a real deal Fated Mates LIVE planned for July 8th in St. Louis, MO! Get tickets to any of these events (Jen will be at a bunch of them, and other pod friends will be popping up along the way) at sarahmaclean.net/tour!
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Our next read along is Cate C Wells's Run Posy Run, available right now in print or ebook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited at Amazon, Apple Books, and Libro.fm.
Notes
Check out the The Collections Department for fun groups of books, organized by real people.
On the shelf, wallflowers, and spinsters.
What does being a spinster look like now?
Louisa Darling suggested the French Guy who made a TikTok about “dating a girl who is used to being alone.”
A contemporary example (other than Bridget Jones) is Gracie from Heaven, Texas by Susan Elizabeth Phillips.
Author Madeline Hunter died in April and was an important member of the romance community. A professor and historian, for many years, Madeline was chair of the RWA Academic Grant Committee, ensuring that researchers and academics had access to funds to research and write about romance. She wrote this piece about spinsters for USA Today in 2015. Our thoughts are with her family, friends and readers.
on the (Book)shelf
SPONSORS
Ava Rani, author of The Charmer, available in print, ebook, and audio from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books, Bookshop.org, and Libro.fm.
1001 Dark Nights, publishers of Sparks and Surrender: An Enemies-To-Lovers Collection, available in print or ebook or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited from Amazon.
Susan Lee, author of The Romance Rivalry, available in print, ebook, or audio, from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books, Bookshop.org, and Libro.fm.
Stephanie Rose, author of A Whole New Ball Game, available in print or ebook, from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, or Bookshop.org.
S07.34: The Third Act Break-Up (Complimentary)
We're gonna get people excited with this one (it's us. we're the ones who are getting excited). Back by popular demand, we're talking craft this week--digging deep into the third-act breakup, what it really means, why it's misunderstood, and why it really is essential to romance. Sarah suggests that every romance has one whether people like to admit it or not, Jen is, as always, ready to fight. Strap in!
Also! It's that time of year again! Sarah has a new book out in July and is going on tour, and there is a real deal Fated Mates LIVE planned for July 8th in St. Louis, MO! Get tickets to any of these events (Jen will be at a bunch of them, and other pod friends will be popping up along the way) at sarahmaclean.net/tour!
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Show Notes
We love Sephora and Ulta, and Sarah has some faves from Dermatology Instagram, like dermangelo and drdrayzday.
Sarah’s on tour for These Summer Storms in July, and Fated Mates Live will be in St. Louis!!
Sarah recommends the audio of The Hero’s 2 Journeys by Michael Hauge
In our discussion, we identified several types of test: Going Home Again, Self-Sacrifice, Who am I?, and You Fucked All the Way Up.
An SD card, for you youths.
3rd act breakup books
Sponsors
Dani Francis, author of Silver Elite, available in print or ebook, from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Cara Dion, author of Claim to Fame, available in print or ebook from Amazon.
Rachel Griffiths, author of The Trouble with Anna, available in print, ebook, audio, from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
Anna Todd, author of The Last Sunrise, available in print or ebook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
S07.33: Heated Rivalry by Rachel Reid
Today we're headed back in the time machine to before the pandemic when everyone but us read this one m/m hockey book and lost their collective minds! Heated Rivalry is one of those books that romance lovers place high up on their keeper shelf, and we're talking about why, about how it really knocks sports romance out of the park (yes, we're aware that there is no knocking out of parks in hockey), and how it might be one of the books that launched a thousand hockey ships.
We're talking about erotica vs. erotic romance vs. romance, about sexy secrets, about first names and about why it's always sexy when people say "I love you" in a foreign language.
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
NOTES
Visit the Fated Mates Collections Department for great romance recommendations organized by micro tropes, characteristics, subgenres, or things like Virgin Heroes. Check out Jen’s collection Hoop! (There It Is) and listen to the 1993 hit song, Whoomp! (There It Is) by Tag Team. Despite having said her name plenty of times, Sarah decided to omit the p in Alice Murphy when talking about her collection.
Barnes & Noble and Amazon holding sales during Independent Bookstore day felt super icky. If you missed it this year, maybe you can find a great indie to visit next year. It’s always the last Saturday in April.
Alan Ritchson is Jack Reacher, Alan Rickman is not.On the road to the NHL, the World Juniors is pretty important.
Professional sports are notably homophobic, especially the NHL despite its history of hosting pride nights. Luke Prokop is the only openly gay professional hockey player, but he does not play in the NHL at this time. The professional sports league with the most openly queer players is the WNBA, which also has a past history of enforcing certain gender norms and gender presentation for its players.
Leagues create rivalries between players and teams in order to promote their brand and ratings. A WNBA case study is Angel Reese & Caitlin Clark.
BOOKS MENTIONED THIS EPISODE
Sponsors
Measured & Slow, purveyors of unique crafted products for people who love books and whimsy. Visit the shop at measuredandslow.studio.
Jillian David, author of Paging Dr. Breakup, available in print or ebook, from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
LaQuette, author of Royal Bride Demand, available in print or ebook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
S07.32: Ruination!
We're talking about the worst possible thing that can happen to a romance heroine today (it's always the heroines) -- ruination! Whether the hero did it, another man did it, or society simply decided that she's ruined, there's simply nothing to be done about it...except revenge, a triumphant return, or the crowning of a new reigning queen. We cover all three here, with almost entirely new to the pod books, and even get some contemporaries into the mix!
If you want more Fated Mates in your life, please join our Patreon, which comes with an extremely busy and fun Discord community! Join other magnificent firebirds to hang out, talk romance, and be cool together in a private group full of excellent people. Learn more at patreon.com.
Our next read along is Rachel Reid's Heated Rivalry, which you can get in print, ebook, audiobook or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited. Find it at Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Kobo, Apple Books or wherever you get your books.
show notes
The Space domination of Katy Perry is depressing compared to the space demotion happening to real women scientists.
In terms of plotting and the hero, Anne Stuart’s Breathless (2010) might be a good precursor to what we call dark romance today.
Actually, you say ratafia like this.
Check out the 2025 Lift for Autism auction, sponsored by Kennedy Ryan.
Stay tuned at the end of the episode for a sneak peek of the audiobook of Piper Rayne's The One I Didn't See Coming.
books mentioned this episode
Sponsors
1001 Dark Nights, publishers of Pride and Passion: A LGBTQIA+ Love Collection, available in print or ebook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
Jess K Hardy, author of Wish You Were Here, available in print or ebook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
Mara Moody, author of The Reunion Recipe, available in print or ebook from Amazon, Barnes & Noble or wherever you get your books.
Piper Rayne, author of The One I Didn't See Coming, available in print, audiobook or ebook, or with your monthly subscription to Kindle Unlimited.
